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LFC: Bigpool, Littlepool, or just another fish in the pool?

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LFC fans bannerWHAT does it mean to be a ‘big’ club?

Daniel Sturridge recently commented on is delight at joining a club that has no Premiership rival ‘bigger’. A sentiment which was completely lost as a different translation was seen and stated by various idiots.

Their translation read more like joining ‘the biggest club in the World/Premiership’.

Now Liverpool FC is a great football club that I follow passionately, but the translated version of Sturridge’s words felt insulting. Was I being humble, strange, defensive and not recognising my own club’s greatness, or was I being patronised and reacting accordingly? Or is any such talk of ‘biggest’ just like juveniles screwing up their fresh faces and shouting ‘my dad’s bigger than your dad’, till they start to swing tiny fists?

What makes a club ‘bigger’ than another?

Stadium size? Anfield is the 7th largest stadium in England. There are 6 teams with bigger stadiums. Does that make six clubs ‘bigger’ then Liverpool FC? If we include Scotland, Anfield is 10th, including Wales and we are 11th. So there are bigger stadiums, but that does that necessarily mean a bigger clubs?

What about world following?

We all know Man U, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal have a huge global following. Who has the largest? How do you tell if someone living in Hong Kong, India or Peru prefers Liverpool to Man Utd if they don’t buy anything and just keep up with scores and catch the odd game on the free-to-view TV service provider? Personally, without any prejudice, I couldn’t care less how many fans Liverpool have in Honduras, Singapore or anywhere else!

Figures for 2012 income places Liverpool 4th, amount paid in wages we’re 4th but all the different figures collected by The Independent place other clubs higher.

If media coverage and scrutiny is anything to go by then I have to agree with Sturridge; no other club has got more attention in the UK than Liverpool over the last few years. Every minute there are approximately 255 babies born in the world – almost as many as the number of ‘things’ written about Suarez! (Some of the pieces sound like the babies actually wrote them.)

History – our favourite measuring stick? Man Utd have one more league but Liverpool have been Champions of Europe twice more. Nottingham Forest, Leeds, and Aston Villa are all big clubs historically as they have won leagues and/or European Cups…but where are they now? Aston Villa have won the league and won in Europe but there are few (outside of the Villa faithful) who cling on to claims of being a big club or the biggest. Such history gets superseded, forgotten and can become irrelevant over time.
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Present – our least favourite measuring stick? 2005 we won the Champions League and 2007 we were so close. Liverpool haven’t challenged for the league since we came second in 2009, and there are around seven clubs above us in the league today and at the end of the season I expect five clubs to be above us, unless we suddenly and dramatically improve on the pitch.

Maybe heavy investments today (e.g. Sneider and Villa etc) are needed as much as a continued investment in tomorrow (Shelvey and the youth). As we’ve seen from Arsenal, if you focus on the future you don’t have a present as the foundations crumble before the project. If Arsenal had been able to get some quality experienced additions I think they would have won the league over the last seven years. In doing so they would have held on to the multitude of talent they unearthed, developed and lost to teams who actually wanted to win enough to go on and do it.

The future – who knows? But I feel we clearly need to improve or resign ourselves to the history books as once-upon-a-time also-rans. The stadium is ridiculously small for a club with our fan base. Why oh why do FSG want to start on it in 2014? All the time spent in talks about a new stadium over the years has been enough to build it 20 times over!

Fergy called Newcastle small, yet had a tantrum, foaming at the mouth at Rafa when he called Everton small…as usual, hypocrisy from old Purple nose.

A few clubs can claim to be bigger than Liverpool due to success over the last 20 years, but only one has a serious case as far as I am concerned and that’s Man Utd. As long as the sum total of European and League top dogs is in Liverpool’s favour there is always an argument to be made that no club is bigger. While we can argue, we will. While we can breathe, we can argue!

Finally, I don’t care who’s ‘dad is bigger’; Liverpool is my club and that’s all that matters. We’d support them if we were in the Championship, and below. After Man City and Chelsea I can understand Sturridge wants supporters to like him immediately. Daniel, if you’re reading: Relax, work hard on the pitch and don’t say anything stupid off the pitch. If you conduct yourself with dignity and most importantly, keep scoring and scoring and scoring, we’ll love you like Fowler (well almost, after all he is ‘God’).

YNWA
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An armchair fan who loves the stadium experience but likes the bread and butter of replays, moronic pundits, a drink in a pub atmosphere. LFC is my religion.

Common sense is missing from football but the situation is always complicated so I endeavour to give opinion and encourage discussion and thought about LFC.

24 comments

  • Con says:

    in terms of stature and fan base Liverpool are the 4th biggest in world football behind Barca , MU, and Real . Which is why it is so disappointing to see the state we are in at the moment

  • Slick Slickington says:

    – Keep The Faith Roger’s Renaissance YNWA J4T96 – Wavertree ’86 –

  • Tomas alley says:

    A great article vikas,lots of good points!

  • Dan says:

    Whether a club is big or not is surely a subjective matter.

    The present league standing is a poor indicator as it requires an appreciation that may not be there in many people. When the Italian match fixing scandal resulted in some of the “biggest” clubs in the world being penalised by dropping down a league, few would have suggested they were no longer big clubs. After all, they were famous (and infamous) around the world even whilst playing in a lower league.If at the time, a survey was carried out to name the biggest clubs in Italy of people who know little about football (also known as ‘women’), most would have named the likes of the penalised Juventus.

    The test then should be whether the Mrs can name them. If so, chances are they are big.

    Look at whats happened to Rangers. Few would class them as anything other than a big club despite the newco starting in a low league and as a newly formed club, having never won anything.Ask any scottish third division footballer though and they’ll say its an honour to play them. Its all about perspective.

    History only takes you so far. As a long suffering Wolves fan (dont mention Luton), I get fed up of hearing we are sleeping giants ready to wake up to the successes of the fifties. It seems to me we’re either comatose rather than sleeping or more likely we should just accept we used to be a big club when dinosaurs roamed the earth but we’re not now. History is only important when the majotity of football fans can remember it without saying the line “in my day, back when I was a nipper…”

    Again money only goes so far in assessing whether a club is big. If its gets them more column inches and discussion by Mr Walkers Crisps and if you hear the term “shocking defending” by Mr Dour (sorry pool fans but he is boring), then for the time being, the club is big. After all everyone knows about them. Thats only temporary though – as Ken club destroyer Bates will testify. Maybe one day Roman Abramovic will get so annoyed at losing Battersea power station to residential developers that he’ll take his money out of Chelsea and into Battersea dogs home.

    Or maybe he’ll give Liverpool another £50million for an out of form striker. As long as they dont invest £30mill of it into a donkey, maybe the money wilk help Liverpool be ‘big’.

    Liverpool are in a lucky position right now that there us still a lot if romance associated with the club. Liverpool have long been many peoples second club as we all like to think about songs like you’ll never walk alone and the association the club has with the city where the beatles came from. People respect the club. I always have done.

    What risks that right now though is not the clubs league position or how many cups it wins. Its whether people respect the clubs ethos. Most football fans dont like how money is ruining the beautiful game or how englishmen rarely get a look in. Looking at Liverpool over the years, I dont automatically think of the likes of Suarez and the spanish contingent. I think of Gerrard, Carragher, Owen, Fowler, Rush, McManaman and co. Liverpool is a club which has stayed close to peoples hearts because it has been a proper football club for the fans, played by fans, run by fans. Too many clubs nowadays dont seem like football clubs anymore. They’ve lost the connection with the fans.

    Liverpool still have that connection and that in my opinion helps makes them a big club.

    Thats the way it is now and how it was back in my day…

    • Prole says:

      That’s the best comment I’ve seen on here and not just because you called Liverpool a big club, but because you backed up your opinion with things that make since. I think there’s a lot to be said for the teams people automatically name off the cuff when asked. No one would bypass: Bayern Munich, Juventus, Ajax, AC Milan, R Madrid, Benfica, Barcelona, Liverpool, Inter Milan, Man Utd, Arsenal, Celtic and the like.

    • Vikas Dhingra says:

      Top top comment Or should I say column. Enjoyed it mate. I agree re big clubs and loved the impartial footy fan perspective.

  • tommy says:

    if we bought sneijder , his wages would be paid by the replica LFC tops sold around the world especailly far east and if he does the business like he has in past , then maybe we would be a top 4 team , with champ league footy next yr and im sure other real footy players would want to come to our great club , to play along side him gerrard and suarez and in front of the BEST SUPPORTERS IN EUROPEAN FOOTBALL

  • Scouse Ed says:

    We were a big club , but two lots of bad owners and the hiring of mediocre managers like Hodgson and Rodgers mean we are not big at the moment . It wouldn’t take much to get us back though – decent owner and decent manager with our fan base we would be back in no time at all

    • Brad says:

      We have decent owners and a great manager. You just have a chip on your shoulder and need something in life to whinge about. I see it all the time with a section of football fans. Rodgers even mentioned it when he was hired speaking of 3 types of supporters, the third being those that will never be happy-when we win by three they will say we should have won by five. Sounds a lot like you!

      • Scouse Ed says:

        Your just a fool that is happy watching rubbish .
        You said ‘when we win ‘ , we dont win anymore , or hadnt u noticed ?

        And saying Rodgers is a great manager just shows your stupidity . LOL . A liverpool manager buys rubbish , doesnt beat 1 good team in 7 months and is 8th in the table , and u call him great ?
        What kind of clown are you ?

      • Dickie o says:

        Decent owners am not to sure about that are they much better then the last two we had the single biggest mistake Liverpool football club have over the last 20 years was Moore’s not selling to DCi when we had the chance the new ground would of been completed long before now and as for the penny pinching over the like.s of clint dempsey i fail to see why anyone would call them good owners…

        • redrum says:

          They are not decent owners , they are the worst kind . It wouldn’t be so bad if they came to fleece the club , make a quick buck and bog off .
          But no , FSG have a long term plan , to build us up , and slowly fleece us dry , their plan wont and cant work ,so we are stuck in limbo whilst the unknowledgable americans mess around with stuff they dont understand

  • tommy says:

    i loved it when sturridge scored at united running to our supporters with a hand held high saying 5 times , just like torres did at the 4-1 win , it showed me he wants us REDS to take him in our hearts , it says im gonna show you all that im a fighter fighting for the best ever fans ,

    • Prole says:

      I think he’ll be a great signing for us. I don’t know yet about the others Rodgers has brought in though.

  • Howard says:

    Liverpool will always be one of the biggest clubs in world football , and we should be one of the richest and biggest spenders . Its all about fan base , thats how a clubs size should be judged

    I do fear we wont be at the top for a long while yet , at least not until our American owners sell up and go home . It should be Reds fans number 1 priority to rid ourselves of owners who are here to make money , not to make us great again

  • Terry Mac says:

    This is a vital time for LFC . Real M, Barca , MU , Bayern are all growing . Chelsea sold more shirts than us this season worldwide , i couldn’t believe it but its true . The likes of Arsenal and Spurs are catching up and rich clubs like PSG and City will win trophies and grow fast .

    We are getting left behind . like it or not people ( especially foreign supporters ) support successful clubs with star players . We are not successful and may lose Suarez soon . FSG are selling the brand but that brand is looking less and less attractive every year

    People say FSG have invested heavily , it simply not true , they bought Liverpool for half its value , and have only spent about 50m net on transfers . If we dont get proper investment soon we might never catch up to the other big clubs

    Football is moving on , but it looks like Liverpool is standing still

  • AP says:

    Very well written
    Loved it!

  • Ozred says:

    All good other than not giving a toss how many people support Liverpool overseas. Here in oz u see 1 Liverpool shirt walking around for every other premier league shirt.

    We buy official merchandise through the website, pay for lfc tv subscriptions and have active supporter groups which directly contribute to the mighty reds.

    Sure probably every secod shirt is purchased from Bali or Thailand but it’s this kind of of global reach that helps make Liverpool one of the biggest clubs in the world dispite performances over the last 20 years.

    Ynwa

  • Chan says:

    We are a big club not only because of our glorious history (with BR around that is the only thing we could look to these days), but also our our LFC way, the fact this club had touch the lives of so many and our never say die approach.

    The fact is we still have a global following despite not winning the league for 23 years. How many teams can do that?

    But all these legacy is in danger and we would firmly remain as also rans with BR in charge.

  • Tony says:

    Big club , small manager , poor owners . The potential for Liverpool is incredible . Get it right on the pitch and we could be the biggest

  • tommy says:

    massive club,honest manager, shrewed owners , i genuinely believe , next season , we’ll see the rewards and it will be even better when the seating in anfield goes up to 62,000 may even be more if the kop gets seats taking out ,, imagine that , 59,000 REDNOSES screaming down to the pitch attack attack , attack attack attack,, yes i believe we’re in safe hands this time ,

  • tommy says:

    just came through sneijder wants to come to LFC

    • stevieG says:

      Not true . He said he would prefer premier league thats all . Stop believing everything you read in the daily rags

  • simon says:

    Huge club …. but getting smaller every year . New manager and new owners are a neccesity for us to grow

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