On this, I tend to agree with Samuel. Us Reds fans have suffered under Hicks & Gillett when there was no consultation or communication of any sort between the owners and the fans. Supporters groups such as the Spirit of Shankly and Share Liverpool grew quickly as fan anger against the American owners increased and played a vital role in getting the two men removed. I couldn’t contain my laughter when I heard Tom Hicks complaining about “internet terrorists,” after he lost ownership of the club. It shows that Reds fans did have an impact on the situation. The new owners tried to be as far removed from the Hicks & Gillett era as possible and their consultations with the fans have been admirable. However, we do not want a situation where fans collectively have the final say on all issues surrounding the club. Us fans may claim to be experts, but I doubt whether we would make the right decisions in the long term interests of the club. Many may admire how Spanish clubs are run but the facts are that Real Madrid, Barcelona and Valencia, three of Spain’s biggest clubs, have racked up hundreds of millions of pounds in debts as president after president have been sworn in by the club’s members and have tried to keep themselves in office by spending money they haven’t got. Of course, no Liverpool fan needs to be told that private ownership can also lead to mountains of debt but if you have the right owners, like I think we now have in FSG, then there should be some trust in their long term vision for the club.
No matter what you say, supporters are prone to short-termism rather than looking at the long term goals. A “benevolent dictatorship” as Samuel says is definitely preferable to a total democratic system. Certainly there should be some sort of minority share ownership of the club by fans as supporters should have a say in what goes on at the club but they shouldn’t dictate club policy on all issues, including the manager. FSG certainly know little about football and I applaud them for taking their time on every issue. I, like many other fans want Roy to leave, but I am willing for FSG to make their own decisions. Questioning FSG’s commitment to the club if they don’t bow to supporter demands is not a great way to start a new era. Fans for their part must be patient, while the owners must listen but have their own minds and not be pressured into decisions which in hindsight they may regret.
FSG have many things to consider over the future of Roy Hodgson. If they get rid of him now, will the right candidates be available? If the right candidate isn’t, do they give the job temporarily to Kenny until the end of the season? What happens then if they want to bring in a young manager who can formulate a long term project rather staying with Kenny? What happens if you keep Roy and have 10,000 empty seats every week? Will Liverpool’s top players become disillusioned if they keep with Roy too long or do you keep with him until the summer when a different manager can come in? It’s a complicated decision, and one I trust FSG to make without my help.
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Hodgson was not condemned to fail by the fans – he was condemned to fail by his inane defensive attitude. The majority of fans took a wait and see approach to Hodgson, but it became apparent almost immediately that his plans were not worth waiting for.
I do agree that the NESV shouldn’t OVERLY concern themselves with listening to the fans though. That WOULD just be a recipe for disaster, as we have just as large (if nor larger) a contingent of knee jerk, over the top fans as any other team.
Well informed, decisive, strategic decision making has to come from the minority at the top with a complete, long term view, rather than from the majority at the bottom with a narrow, short term view
the daily facist rag hates all things liverpool, kenny must be hard up to write for them, one hack patrick collins called us “anfield filth” for calling poor old woy names. sunday mail.
the club belongs to the fans – who could get rid of any owner who thinks they can ride roughshot over them, the value ofthe club was built by the fans and the teams the history is theirs. these are manchester based biased nobody’s.
there has been no knee jerk reaction, every criticism i have seen of this managerhas been reasoned and true, hodgson has nothing but contemt for the fans, he has proved it time and again, going against the protests because he thinks only his bosses mattered, even now his “the owners back me” “the team back me” (i dont believe it)is another insult to the crowd, i diddnt know he could lagh until i saw him with his so called friend ferguson yesterday, evryone know ferguson loves losers – its winners he despises.
Please all LFC fans sign this petition and pass it on to other LFC fans you know. I’m not too sure how much of an impact it will have but we could atleast try. It was put up after the Wolves game and already has 17,904 signatures. WE NEED MORE so we can get rid of this clown.
here’s the link:
http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?hodgson
I’d disagree that fans think short term, whereas owners focus on long term goals.
Certainly many fans want success and they want it now. But there are a large majority that know what a realistic target it. Add to that, we’re fans for life – we’ll be here long after Hodgson is gone, long after FSG has exited. Ownership and management turns over every once in a while, but as fans we stay for life. Comparing long-term to short-term interests, I’d say fans have the biggest stake by far.
Martin Samuel is a clod. So are his ilk, who think Roy is Mourinho
there is one option missing in todays vote maybe there should have been an option for NO ONE right now!
It’s ‘strike a chord’ you pleb!
The article as by Samuel as you rightly suggest was ill informed, poorly researched and hardly worth reading.
I have to agree with your points against it.
The problem with your article is the second part which lacks vision or foresight. The logical consequence of your argument is that Hicks and Gillett were right simply by reason of their being owners.
Unfortunately, it’s your reasoning that’s erroneous here. Everything that LFC does is paid for or has been paid for by the fans whether it’s through ticket purchases, merchandise purchases, tv subscriptions or anything else that punters shell out their hard earned for.
NESV realise that and have not promised to come into the club to demonstrate their largesse by throwing huge sums of money about. Their approach is that LFC must be a viable, sustainable operation… the fans must fund current account operations.
If that’s the case then morally and financially fans have every right to exercise their discretion in supporting owners past, present and future.
To paraphrase Shanks the holy trinity is the players, the manager and the fans… directors don’t come in to it.
THAT is what makes LFC special and what makes LFC different. Samuel doesn’t get it, you don’t get it but… Rafa did and that is why he stood up against the directors and the owners to defend the team and the fans.
Hodgson doesn’t even understand what was going on because he lacks philosophical integrity and that’s why we need a new manager who understands that.
Kenny was only ever going to be a caretaker for the overwhelming majority of Reds because we know we need a new dynasty who will put us and the team first as Shanks intended.
YNWA
who is good enough to manage liverpool football club?lets give roy a chance at least to the end of the season and let him try and win something for us the fans because thats what we all want as fans to win a cup,a league, a trophy !well thats what i want as a fan .i want success for this club and if we think about this at this stage of the season is it logical to sack roy and bring in a new manager ,thats totally unacceptable and crazy ,lets ride out this storm at least till the end of the season and then judge him then,but ask yourself s this -will you be singing his name if we win something or shouting kenny across the fields at him!
In most cases I would agree with you, but I think Roy has demonstrated he is happy with mediocrity which is the only thing that to us that is unacceptable. The main worry for me is that if we continue to give him time and judge him at the end of the season, we could be acting too late. I genuinely believe that we could slip back into relegation territory if he stays because his tactics allow EVERY team in that league to relentlessly attack us and maintain far too much possession in our half. Plus, the poor attendances will get even worse, and NESV will have to take notice of that as their matchday revenue will plummet.
The part of the article that struck a chord with you was the part that annoyed me the most. Whilst every fan has their opinions on who our next manager should be, I doubt many of them have this sudden ‘sense of entitlement’ to dictate to NESV who that should be, just because they are keen to engage with us. Its another media lie to renforce a pathetic stereotype that we are hysterically outraged by everything – a ‘self pity city’ who whinge for the sake of it.
To anyone with an ounce of common sense however, not just LFC fans, its clear Roy just isnt up to the job, based solely upon poor tactics resulting in poor performances (never mind all the press conference gaffes).
The accusation that LFC fans think they deserve to run the whole show, just because we played our part ousting Hicks and Gillett is insulting and designed to undermine our confidence in NESV, and undermine the fact that our ‘fan power’ actually helped rid us of the real cancer at the heart of our club, a proud highlight of an otherwise miserable year. The media seem intent on turning even that victory into a negative too.
Agreed… while I don’t believe that Roy is the answer and I get incredibly frustrated on most match days, I wish that some of our fans would cool down their overly vocal negativity. Now that a lot of our more vocal supporters have managed to (very commendably) contribute to ousting the previous owners, some of them seem to be a a loose end, and have now turned to petitioning and demonstrating against the current manager.
We need a new manager, but more than that, we need the right manager for the long term. NESV/FSG and LFC can’t afford to hire another stepping stone, so now that we have the right people at the top, let us give them the time they need to get the right men in the right jobs. It’s in all of our best interests.
I also think that we can’t allow ourselves to become accepting of mediocrity, but I honestly don’t believe that FSG are the kind of people who buy into a sports venture to watch it perform averagely season after season. They have the means and the know how to make us great again. Give them time.
el nino, give roy a chance six months and liverpool fc yes liverpool fc have a negative goal differnce. he is pathetic, worse than hicks and gillett, thats how bad he is for our club.
stan h,honestly i think bringing in a new manager now will just make things worse not better ,lets support the team and the staff !and lets try and win something this season ,i know it wont shut up all the fans that dont like roy but we are still involved in cups here and in europe .would nt it be nice to win something this season ???
this manager is an insult to the fans, he continually disrespects them. THAT is why he is despised, results wont change that.
If he stays on til the end of the season, our El Nino will certainly move to another club. Can 77 do what our number 9 does?
stan h,an insult to the fans!and so on and on ,cal,el nino will certainly move to another club.well my reply is this that we get behind the team as fans do and support the manager stan ,i think thats best for the club at the moment and cal if fernando wants to leave and does love playing for the club well let him ,i think we need to find thses players that want to play for liverpool and not the money.i like f torres just as much as the next guy or girl,but theres going to be no european football next season unless we start showing support !ynwa