PROS
Liverpool have been linked with the Stewart Downing since January. A lot of the complaints about us being linked with him have been down to one fact among many Reds fans: he isn’t Juan Mata. From my point of view though, the comparisons between the Spanish playmaker and the England winger are completely unfair, they are not similar styles of player at all. Mata on the one hand could only be loosely described as a winger as he prefers to play in the whole behind the strikers, while Downing has always been more comfortable down the flanks.
One of the probable reasons why Downing maybe a bigger priority for Dalglish and Comolli than Mata currently, maybe because they are looking for a more natural winger to compliment the characteristics of Andy Carroll. Of course Mata maybe a superior dribbler and has a better passing range, but I feel that Downing maybe favoured purely because he would give the team more width than Mata would.
For sure, Downing has played as a central midfield player both at Middlesbrough and Aston Villa, but you only have to look at the video footage by ElPistoleroJFT96 below to see that most of his assists last campaign came from crosses, many of which came from his weaker right foot too:
[youtube s38jnV1FyKo]
Even from a 3 minute clip, a person who hadn’t even seen the player before can see that Downing can keep genuine pace while running with the ball, can shoot and pass with either foot, and has a variety to his game which means he can provide through balls as well as being a decent crosser.
7 goals and 7 assists in a poor season for Villa, as well as the club’s player of the season award isn’t a bad case to put forward for buying the player.
CONS
The question becomes though, is he worth the £15million being suggested? With two years left on his contract, would we be just paying over the heads for an above average player?
Somebody like Mata is only valued a £3million more, and at 23, he is 3 years Downing’s junior with probably a greater amount of vision and skill on the ball. Going by the stats, Downing wasn’t fantastic at either dribbling and delivering decent crosses last season, and although he has had a very good season, is he the sort of player which will push the club up to the next level of being league contenders once again?
For many fans the answer is no, and every time I have put up a transfer rumour on this site linking the player with us, a few fans cry out at the apparent waste of money.
Still, I go back to the point I made at the top of the article. What sort of player is Kenny Dalglish looking for? He is looking for width, pace and guile to help out Andy Carroll and to give the side a different dimension, and if we do purchase Downing, it will be certain that he believes the 26 year old is the man to do that. Whether he is right, we will have to find out next season and how many assists he provides for the likes of Carroll.
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Bring in Mata !!
I’d have Downing down the left and Mata down the right, interchanging throughout the game like Villa do with Downing and Young, we do afterall need players right and left
i agree
Me too.
i agree also i think downing is worth about 17.5mil at the most and mata is worth about 23mil at the most lol over i think it will cost about 43mil for both them based on the every clubs evaluation
Downing was incredible last season, some would say ‘the pick of a bad bunch’ but i really dont understand why people call him just above average. Hes quality but i hope you turn a blind eye to him so that we can keep him here at villa where he’ll be appreciated a bit more. UTV!
The worrying thing reading from many Liverpool fans opinion is many are already resigned to the team doing business with the only defence so far being Kenny knows best. The transfer window has a long way to go but the player links and activities so far seem to have drained the excitement fans felt before the last 2 games of last season where the team seemed to implode or conspire to miss out on Europa depending on different points of view. Normally fans should be happy with the signings first and foremost and not be resigned to all but give up and resort to COUNTING ON KENNY. This will heap a lot of pressure on Kenny as well as having a team made up of players fans are not too happy to have in their team and I am sure Roy Hodgeson can write a book on how it feels to be unwelcome. I sincerely hope fans are treated to a new signing who will reignite passion and keep the club united since the reappointment of Kenny. There is a lot of hope still because only one player has been signed and there is almost two and half months to 31 August.
i cant see why we would need a player like downing. with suarez and another similar player as part of a three like mata we would play the quick passing free flowing football kenny has tried to get us to play last season. a 4.4.2 would not work with suarez on the pitch and i wouldnt change his game to accomadate downing
Downing has always been an average player and regularly goes missing throughout games. We need quality, not another lame duck. Ashley Young is better than Downing but we let him go to United.
According to Villa fans Downing >>>>>>>>> Ashley Young. Also, Downing has outperformed Young in 3-4 seasons.
Downing is very pacy, that’s not the issue with some stupid fans, the issue is he isn’t fancy and doesn’t do step overs. Who cares? He does what he needs to, beats his man for pace and whips a ball in.
Also, he had 9 assists and 7 goals in the league this season according to the official Premierleague website.
Yeah I agree!
Both but as a priority Downing. A player that can cross with both feet when Andy Carroll’s about is priceless
if to archive highest level mata the answer but if we are looking for the short term with targeting to win the EPL i prefer downing, if want more easily just buy both of them anyway downing much better then ashley young
I like Downing but I don’t think he fits FSG’s remit. He’s 27 on July 22 so we would never get a return on him. Only truly world class players command high fees above the age of 30 and there are only a select few clubs that will be interested.
Wage wise I guess he’d be looking for £75k/wk+. If we pay £12m for him and he plays for us for 5 years then leaves on a free or nominal fee it will cost us about £125,000/wk. That’s a lot of dough
We can’t win the league with kids, just ask Arsenal. We need some experience in there, not everyone must be a 20 year old. Also, if we want the best English players we need to pay the price no matter how ridiculous it may sound. £15m for Downing is a very good price imo considering he was the best left winger in the league last season whilst playing in a poor team too. He outperformed Silva, Adam Johnson etc.
Tell FSG that. As I’ve said, I like Downing. I just don’t think he fits the new business model.
I bet Kenny likes him but Comolli and FSG don’t. The number one cost at LFC is wages. If we buy a player at 20 – 24 years of age for £10m play him for 3 years and sell hime at his peak for £20m we get our entire investment back plus the cost of his wages, for instance.
Downing offers no return business wise, I don’t think he’ll shift shirts and they’ll factor that into the overall cost too.
This might not be what you want to hear but it’s realistic when you consider the financial climate and the new Fair Play rules, any player we purchase must have a resale value and hopefully shift merchandise as well.
FSG have hardly broke the bank with us yet, they’ve spent just that £16-20m on Henderson since the Torres + Babal sale broek even with Carroll + Suarez. If we want to win the league anytime soon we need players who are good to go right now and can help us finally bring it back. Downing is one of them. If Dalglish wants Downing (which I suspect he does), Dalglish gets Downing. Or at least that’s how it should work.
So really it would depend on what we get him for! The lower the price the more that money can be used for wages (then we probably could recoup some of this in say three years time by selling on to a team that like established, but older PL players)! If he had one year of his contract left then it would have obviously helped, but with two years they won’t let him go on the cheap!
That video clip only shows downing getting down the left and putting a decent ball in once, not sure if its what we need or if I’m a fan.
That video doesn’t tell the full story. Google Downing vs Man Utd and watch that. Also, go on youtube and search Stewart Downing and watch some of his old clips at Middlesborough. If the videos don’t do it for ya look at the stats: 7 goals and 9 assists in the league this season and he’s also performed that well on 2-3 other seasons at Middlesborough, in one he got 10 assists and 5 goals and in another 9 goals and 5 assists.
i go for mata and carzola
I agree.
You’re right, there is no valid comparison between Downing and Mata: Mata is simply miles better. And he’d be miles better for Liverpool than Downing could ever be – Carroll or no Carroll. And that’s why Liverpool fans prefer Mata. If you’re going to spend lots of money on an attacking player – our marquee attacking midfielder for this summer – quite rightly comparisons are made.
Also, if you’ve watched Valencia play for the past 3/4 years, you’d actually realise Mata does indeed play on the left and on the wing. Mata is just a better all round threat who is great at wing play and moving in-field.
Would you say that Mata is a better player than Downing in the Premierleague? That’s right. Downing has been tested here in the Premierleague and outperformed Silva whilst playing in a much weaker team, who’s to say he won’t outperform Mata if he comes here? Also, Downing is an out and out winger whereas Mata is more of a wide attacker and always cuts in to shoot.
Before we signed Torres, he scored 14 goals in 2006-07. That same season in the EPL, Benni McCarthy scored 18 goals, Yakubu 12, and Viduka 14. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but we paid a lot on money because Torres was infinitely more talented than all 3 EPL players mentioned above (the latter 2 of which for a time scored regularly for a number of seasons). Playing for Liverpool brings a pressure that you don’t get at other clubs. Ask Bellamy. There is no definitive answer to your question (as time will tell), but it is evidently clear that Mata has FAR more talent than Downing and will thus have a better chance of being a success at Liverpool.
Mata is very similar to Silva not Torres. Comparing Mata to Torres is stupid really. Mata will most likely perform at the level Silva is and Downing had him beat this season.
In addition, Silva was actually one of City’s best performers this year. And whilst stats suggest Downing was more successful, stats don’t tell the entire story. If you look at Alonso’s stats for us prior to being sold, he didn’t have the most assists or goals – but it was clear that he was one of the reasons we finished second that year. Silva makes Man City tick. He oozes class. When he played badly, invariably so did City. It’s the same principle with Mata. Downing’s opta stats for dribbling isn’t even in the top 4 by the way
Lewis, your missing the point. I’m not comparing Mata to Torres at all. The comparison I drew is merely to illustrate the absurdity of your point. The point I was making is that Viduka, McCarthy and Yakubu were all scoring regularly in the Premiership. Therefore by your logic, we should of purchased those players instead of Torres because they were proven in the Premiership and Torres at the time wasn’t. If you recall, Torres was actually considered somewhat of a risk. But we know Torress became one of the best players in the world with us. Viduka et al could never match his talent, let alone his achievements with us. The same principle applies to Downing and Mata (and Silva).
It doesn’t matter how fancy Silva looks on the ball, at the end of the day it’s all about end product. Stewart Downing outperformed David Silva whilst playing in a much poorer team, fact. I bet if he wasn’t English and his name was Downinho you’d be all over him.
Looking fancy on the ball? I’d actually define that as technique, which by the way is a great asset for ball retention and breaking down teams. Silva, who was a PLAYING member of the Spanish Euro winning team (and bit player of the world cup team) has technique in abundance.
Incidentally, there was a “Downinho” who actually played for Liverpool – Riera. And he was alright at best, and so no I wasn’t his biggest fan. If the stats game is all you base your argument on, then perhaps you need to check opta more often: N’Zogbia wins hands down over Downing.
What about Johnson at man city? If they’d let him go!!!
The lad that was second fiddle to Downing at Middlesborough? Or the lad who was sold to City at half the price Downing with a broken foot went to Villa whilst being much younger too? Or the guy that has yet to outperform Downing whilst playing in a much better team?
He’s a quality player. Pace, delivery and adaptability. Just because he doesn’t have a silly 30 million clause in his contract doesn’t mean he’s no good. My issue is the price. He is worth between 12-14 million and 15 million is pushing it. No reason why we can’t have both Mata and Downing. Different types of players they both are.
Agreed Pedro with the silly buy out clauses. I’d rather Mata, Turan and N’Zogbia over Downing, however, if we did get any 1 of these players we’d be much better off on the LW pos’n than we’ve been for the last several years! The left is key for us, as we are fully stacked on the right side (Kuyt, Kelly, G.Johnson, Gerard, Suarez). By getting a player of Downing’s ability (trust me, I’ve been negative towards a Downing deal, but he’s a quality player, but worth more like 12m.) that will be the necessary supply that Carroll and Co needs up front. LFC are 4 players away from Domination of the Prem!, and eventhough I trust Kenny and Co. we have to get the right players in here and sell about 5-6 players that can raise 35m (Aquilani 13m, Jova 4m, Cole 2m, Poulsen 2m, Konchesky 3m, Ngog 5m, Agger 7m)..That money can buy you a Downing at 12m or Mata at 20m and then buy impt players that can supliment the remaining pos’n. Baines 14m, Park Chu Young 7m and a qulaity proven striker! I’ve been begging for Falcao for 3 years now and look at him now! 🙁
Still, the best bet is Mata, Turan and N’Zogbia over Downing
No arguments. I rate all 4 of the wingers you mentioned quite highly. N’Zogbia may be an issue with his history with Carroll though. Falcao may unfortunately be on his way to Chelsea with AVB seemingly becoming their manager. I really don’t know how that will work out with the prima donnas they’ve got as their strikers. Hopefully we sort out the deals for all our targets quickly and get a good pre-season under our belt.
Lmao. You now rate Turan over Downing. Pathetic.
Who are you referring to with that comment?? If your referring to me, well I rate all those wingers equally. They’re playing styles differ but they offer something our team currently lacks(genuine width.) To me N’Zogbia and Downing look like the most realistic options. Turan seems to be off our radar and Mata has a line of suitors who are much better off as club than us at the moment waiting.
easily the best english winger last year no question, his consistency was ridiculous, wen nothing else was going for us he’d be there to create a chance, much more consistent than young, his ability and accuracy is incredible he can easily beat a man and deliever an inch perfect cross even with his weaker foot, he’ll be worth 25 million next season and u’ll have been wishing ud have bought him, maybe this Mata guy has more talent but there is no question that downing will always create and score more goals (put together) than him because of his consistency but if u guys dont want him ur loss! + didnt he terror ur defence last time he played u aswell…..just saying xD
I really rate Stewart Downing. He may not be oozing with flair or anything but with him you’ll know what you get. I’d take him over Young any day of the week. Young isn’t even a proper winger anymore. Downing/AJ + Mata, that’s what I’m hoping for at the end of the window for Liverpool with regard to wide players. Btw, as a Villa fan, what do you think about his pic with the Liverpool scarf??…..Trust me that pic is legitimate (I’m a visual designer and know my way around photoshop and there is nothing doctored in that photo. Those extra set of fingers are actually strings at the end of the scarf) whatever your boys may tell you…..just asking xD
Yea, that picture looks defiently 100% real to me. And yea, I totally agree Downing is far better than Young, especially as a winger. We don’t need anymore wingers who cut in 99% of the time, we have Joe Cole, Maxi etc. We need direct wingers with pace and Downing is one of them.
i will prefer both of them in the team.
I can only judge a player on the evidence of my own eyes. I’ve seen Downing play against us about 10 or 12 times and he hasn’t impressed me once. He scored a good goal this season, but apart from that he’s carried hardly any threat. He’s not particularly pacey or exceptionally skillful. His crosses vary in quality and he drifts in and out of games. If he was worth a Liverpool shirt then a host of top clubs would want him, but they don’t. I’m due to pay £780 for my season ticket this week. The thought of it going towards Downing’s wages is underwhelming.
Do you remember a few years back when Downing destroyed us? He zoomed past Benayoun as if he wasn’t even there and slotted it past Reina.
“Zoomed past Benayoun”, hardly the stuff of legend. He is a decent player, but not of the quality required to mount a serious and sustained challenge for the title. If he was recruited, he would have to be to strengthen the bench, but not at the price quoted.
What “quality” do you require then? Messi? Be realistic. At the moment Downing IS the best left winger in the league so no he would go straight into our first team. It doesn’t matter how much you hate Downing for doing your mom or whatever, he is a good winger and if Kenny wants him, Kenny gets him.
Mata`s a no brainer, what we need is quality. Im sick of all the rumours linking us to every player. Kenny just bring in quality.YNWA.
Mata is an exciting, creative player who plays wide n anywhere behind the striker. he is pacey, a good dribbler, and can also create and score goals . he’s obviously class no doubt. If he blends quickly n can reproduce the magic he displays in Valencia, he’ll definately be a fantastic signing plus he’ll also be a very good piece of business considerin his age n resale value.
But look at the risks involved. d obvious one is ‘wot if he cant adapt to the physical nature of the league?’ as we saw last season, it took Silva more than half of the season to start puttin in good performances. Mata is small in size and bulk n would be a very big risk especially at dis very crucial time of rebuilding. besides am still not convinced that Mata is a natural winger. he comes across as a wide attacker (just like Sanchez).
Now Downing.. as for dose talking about resale value, I believe there should always be exceptions. who says every player bought must always have a higher resale value? Just look around at players like Berbatov, David Villa, etc. resale value or not, they contributed something to their clubs. There is little or zero risk involved in signing Downing. he’s bn consistent over the years. If he could play dat well in a team like Villa where there are only two other class players (A. Young and the largely inconsistent Agbonlahor), who’s to say he’ll not do beta in Liverpool with players like Steven G, Suarez and (his friend) Carroll? we’ve bn crying 4 an out n out winger to give us width which we so badly need, and Downing (though not the most explosive winger u know) will do a good job.
also wot happens, when we need to defend? Mata is a ‘Messi’ kind of player n will offer little or nothing defensively. Downing on the other hand is not afraid to get stuck-in and he also defends fairly well.
Another key factor is fitness. Downing is a very fit player, while Mata seems fragile. Trust me, d last thing I want to see is another Aurelio(or Agger).
While I believe Mata is technically beta, Downing is more mature, consistent, n proven in d Premiership plus he’s English n will help us comply with the homegrown rule.
u guys should remember how Mourinho transformed Chelsea. he didn’t look for exciting players or name brands. rather, he got good players who can ‘do their jobs’.
both…